A Human Approach To Your Schedule ft. Becca Rich

Uriah
Hello and welcome back to the Productive Therapist Podcast! Thank you so much for listening. Today I had a really fun conversation with Becca Rich. She's a visionary who cuts through the BS of the billion dollar productivity industry, creating a ripple effect with holistic time management. She helps business owners and professionals heal from time scarcity and shows them how to team up with time to work less and live more. Doesn't that sound amazing? As a trauma sensitive, certified holistic coach with a background in engineering and mindfulness, she knows traditional time management is outdated and harmful. If you've been searching for a different way forward, Holistic Time Management is here to help you create a life of peace at work, at home, and within. Please enjoy my conversation with Becca Rich. Becca, welcome to the podcast!

Becca
Hello. Thanks for having me.

Uriah
Yeah, I'm so happy to meet you for the first time, as well as talk about some of our shared mutual favorite topics, which is exciting.

Becca
Yeah, nerding out. I love nerding out.

Uriah
Yes. I am just so happy that as a therapist that I've been able to take all of my other interests outside of the therapy world, which is like productivity, time management, technology, software, and find an avenue for those. It's been a good thing.

Becca
Yeah. And time management is the foundation to your life living. So it's a great interest to have.

Uriah
Time is your life is what you say, I believe, right? Yeah, it is. That's well known. But I definitely want to get into that a little bit. However, I thought it'd be interesting and fun to... If you wouldn't mind sharing a little bit about your story about how you became a holistic time management coach, which is an interesting thing we'll get into. That would be wonderful.

Becca
Yeah, of course. First and foremost, hello, I'm Becca Rich. I got into this as an oath to my healing, honestly. I think that's really common for coaches and people in service industries or professions. I grew up with a dad as an entrepreneur. My grandpa was an entrepreneur. And both of them and how they went about their days and working really impacted me. And so when I became an engineer, immediately burned out, was in the hospital with a deadly intestinal infection because I wasn't taking care of myself at all. I realized that that wasn't sustainable and I really needed to take better care of myself. And I didn't really know how. And I was really ingrained in like, I have to always be doing something. I have to get things done. There's always things to do. I can't sit still. Very type A. I have to plan everything. That was my life. And that was about 10 years ago. And slowly, over the last decade, I got into yoga and I became a yoga teacher and a Reiki healer and a meditation teacher. And over that time, I learned how to incorporate more presence and slow down and take a deep breath. And it started to, like, impact how I thought about time and how I went about work. And I realized I didn't want to spend my life in a cubicle working for the oil and gas industry. And I wanted to do something a little bit more helpful for the planet and us all as human beings inhabiting it. And I realized all of my private clients as a yoga teacher were struggling with, I don't have time to come to yoga. I don't have time to take care of myself. It's really hard. I feel guilty when I do. And it was just all of those stories that prevent us from being able to take time for ourselves and prioritize ourselves, our health, our well being. And I realized that over that time, I was actually learning how to do this. I was learning how to put myself first, prioritize my health and slow down and be more present. And I was like, hey, I can help with this, maybe potentially. And so became a time management consultant just to pick apart time management and find all the things that's wrong with it. And then became a holistic coach and combined all of my experience to what it is now today.

Uriah
That's so very cool. So I have a title for your memoir. Are you ready?

Becca
Yeah.

Uriah
From engineer to Reiki Healer or Reiki Healer. Does that sound good? That's such an interesting progression of your career, right? Yes. So lots of things we could talk about, but I'm curious if you don't mind going back and saying a little bit more about your early days of being an engineer. And you said I immediately burned out. So what was going on then? And maybe you mentioned a few things, but what was that about?

Becca
I constantly got sick growing up. I had shrub throat four times a year, and my stomach always hurt h. I had all of these non issues but weird sickness stuff. And none of it was totally serious until I got sick and I was losing all of this weight and I was just not taking care of myself. I was also drinking a lot and partying and whatever. And I was just not doing the things, not working out, not eating healthy. And I got on antibiotics and they just destroyed my intestines. And I just was in the hospital with issues with my intestines. So that's the physical side. And then the mental external side, it was very much like a friend had to bring me to the hospital because I didn't want to go. I was like, I have stuff to do. I was like, I have to meet this deadline. I'm not going to get taken care of. And I think of that as a rock bottom moment. So yeah, it was very much like, I have all the things.

Uriah
Yeah, thanks for sharing that. I appreciate that. Once upon a time, productive therapists, one of our unofficial slogans was like, Saving Therapists From Burnout, which I thought that's actually still pretty good, right? Because in all kinds of industries, certain kinds of personalities are at risk for burnout and certainly caretaking type service industries, right? And also, of course, entrepreneurs and all of that is a whole different culture. Very cool. So you stumbled upon all these wonderful healing modalities and then holistic time coaching because you were trying to, if I heard you correctly, support your yoga clients in making time for self care and those kinds of things, right?

Becca
Yeah. I started as my first iteration of my business. I was doing yoga retreats. I had a yoga weekend retreat and private clients and things like that. And I was calling myself a yoga coach. And I was like, I'm helping people learn how to do yoga. But it slowly became less and less about the physical movements and stretching and stuff. And it was like, the whole point of yoga is to just be with yourself, go inwards, get to know yourself, be present. And from there, that's when all of the clarity and the solutions about how you want to live, what you want to do with your precious life and time. I like it. Yeah.

Uriah
I love that. It's funny, not everybody, most people don't start out with one career goal, and then 42 years later, they retire. That used to happen a lot more. And now it's almost all of our stories are probably quite different. If you had told me that I was going to be a business coach at some point when I was 20 years old, I'd be like, That's funny. I'm trying to be a therapist. But you follow your intuition and you follow the path that life provides for you. And hopefully, you end up doing things that light you up and make you excited, which it sounds like you're doing. It's so cool.

Becca
Yeah. And now I quit my job in July of 2020, and I've been traveling the world since then. So I can't complain. It's been awesome.

Uriah
Love that. Yeah, that's awesome. So I know it's self explanatory, but I thought it would be interesting to talk about something that I found on your website, which is the statement, your time is your life. What does that mean to you?

Becca
When we think about time, we think of like, oh, it's May fourth at 312 PM my time. And it's like this human construct. And then we forget that time is actually like the sun rising every day. And it's something greater and spiritual and bigger than us. And so when we think about, like, May fourth, Thursday, whatever, that's when we get into that nitty gritty doing energy of like, I have to cram and optimize this day and all of this stuff. And when we zoom back out, it really leaves some of that pressure. And it also helps us gain greater perspective. And so this statement of your time is your life helps us tap back into that bigger, greater perspective, the spiritual perspective of time that that we don't have to figure all of this stuff out all of the time. It's not about optimizing every second. It's just about living.

Uriah
I like that. I've heard somebody say that time is either the only nonrenewable resource or one of the only nonrenewable resources. But it's true. Once May fourth, 2023 is over, we don't get to go back and redo that.

Becca
And what's cool is hat is the human construct. We also have in a second from now, in another second from now, in another breath from now. And so it's like time is so cool to my brain, my engineering brain and my spiritual brain, because it gets to play around with both of these things. And it comes back to one of the most important paradigms for me is that I am not a human being having a spiritual experience, sometimes I'm a spiritual being having a human experience. And so shifting that is like the being and the doing, how can I just be and get some things done that are important to me versus I need to do all of these things so I can be and rest and relax.

Uriah
That's a shift. I haven't looked at it, and I know we just spoke about not reading non-conviction, but I saw that Rainn Wilson, the guy from The Office, wrote a spiritual book, and it touches on some of the things you just mentioned there. Yeah, it might be an interesting read.

Becca
It might be a non-conviction book that we pick up eventually. Yeah.

Uriah
And who knew Dwight from the office had a spiritual teacher in him? I don't know.

Becca
Maybe so. His character made him think a lot about all of that, probably.

Uriah
Maybe that. Yeah. So I'm curious, with all this, there are unique challenges that entrepreneurs, small business owners face when it comes to time management, productivity, and those types of things. And we tend to be more linear and focused about, I got to get this done by this deadline. So what are the challenges you see, maybe some of your clients or just people in general, who are business owners bumping up against?

Becca
Yeah. So honestly, so many because to me, time is everything. And I say all of this if you're listening, with lots of love, there's nothing wrong with you. There's no urgency to fix or change or pathologize you. But one of the most common things that I hear is that it should be easy. Managing my time should be easy, and I should have already figured it out by now. And that prevents a lot of people from working with me. I've had clients come into my sphere and then a year or two later still be in the same place struggling. And they're like, I didn't want to work with you at that time because it felt frivolous and it felt like I should have already figured it out. And it felt like it was a weird thing to to invest in time coaching. I should work on my business, but time is underneath that. Time is the foundation of your business, your life, your health, your well being, all of the things. So that's one of the most common things that maybe we're not consciously thinking of. Shame and.

Uriah
Self judgment, it really is what you're talking about. Essentially, yes. I should already know this. I should be able to figure this out on my own. Yeah.

Becca
Okay. Essentially, yeah. And time management and our culture is so poppy and I don't know. It has this weird... Headliney. Yeah, it's like hacks. And that's like, oh. And then more on the tangible side, the most common thing is over committing, saying yes to just too much stuff and not knowing what to say yes and no to and being overly optimistic with how much you can do, which is part of that over committing is we think we can do so much more in a day than we can. And that is part of my job is to help people just sometimes crank open some white space in their schedule and their calendars.

Uriah
Yes, literally and metaphorically, yes.

Becca
With a loving, gentle hand.

Uriah
Related to that, one thing that I noticed, and I've been guilty of this too, is not adding in or creating any buffer in my daily schedule. For example, not creating time for lunch, for eating properly, or just stacking appointments so much that it's like, even if I'm sitting in this chair the entire time, there's no time between now and the next meeting. This one. So that I think is... And that probably comes from the mindset of like, Well, I got to squeeze in as much as I possibly can because I've only got so many hours in the day.

Becca
Yeah. Got to get the most out of May fourth, Thursday. May fourth.

Uriah
Not good for humans, though, is it? No. For health and well being and overall functioning, it's just not a good recipe.

Becca
And it's not even good for our clients. We're not showing up for our people. We're not showing up for anybody. We're doing literally everybody a disservice.

Uriah
Right. One of my favorite therapist mentors over the years has been Irvine Yalom. He's an amazing guy. He wrote a bunch of books. He actually wrote a bunch of fiction books that told stories that communicated all the ideas and concepts of therapy in the therapeutic process. Actually super interesting. He's here in California. Anyway, long story short, in his later years, he would teach and write and consistently saw clients for, I don't even know, 50 plus years. But he would see clients in his office on his property, and he would see three clients a day. And for every client he would see, he would spend time preparing and before and after the session, just thinking and writing and processing and then giving that person the best of his attention. I don't know. I just thought that was cool.

Becca
Yeah. And then there's something I wanted to add. I love that I even wrote down his name because that's what my book is going to be about is a fiction about the work that I do. Yeah, I'm super excited. And we have the beauty of technology to support us with this. I use Calendly to schedule everything, and I have 15 minutes before and after that's always checked off. No one can schedule anything back to back on my schedule, and I only have three days that clients can schedule with me, and they self schedule whenever they need to. And that's how we set up coaching. And it feels like there's boundaries, there's a lot of trust, there's a lot of spaciousness, and there isn't this, you know, just complete try and squeeze and optimize. And it's intentional. All of.

Uriah
That is what you're saying. Very much so.

Becca
Good. Yeah. On both sides.

Uriah
Yeah. Yes. I like it. So for people who are listening to this and they're like, this is amazing. I would love to hear you talk about what is time coaching and what is holistic time management, because that may not be something that people have heard of. But I guarantee you that every therapist who hears holistic time management would be like, oh, that sounds interesting. Tell me more.

Becca
Yeah. And I think I love that you asked that they're different things because they are. Holistic time management is the modality that I actually train and certify coaches and therapists and service providers in. And it's a way of approaching time management with your whole human self involved. We look at your work, your life, your family, your relationships, your everything, and we learn who you are, mind, body, soul, and use all of that information to spend your time and alignment with your body and your mind and your soul and all the things. The biggest thing, the shift is prioritizing self first. So doing what I just mentioned, adding 15 minutes before and after, and that's just one small strategy that comes from I'm much better for myself and for my clients when I have time and space to go use the bathroom or get a sack or get up and move or whatever I need to do. As opposed to traditional time management, which we've already discussed of optimizing productivity and efficiency. And the whole goal of traditional time management is to complete as many things as possible in the shortest amount of time, and that's exhausting. Efficiency, yes. Efficiency. And I say effectiveness. I think efficiency and effectiveness are the difference between traditional and holistic. And traditional time management just doesn't work because the to do list never end. We can't ever get ahead. So that's the whole hamster wheel thing. And so time coaching uses the modality of holistic time management. But coaching really is using the skill of coaching, partnering up with someone to investigate and really figure out how they want to spend their time for their whole self and really work on healing the foundation, the stuff underlying, what's preventing you from spending your time that way, and then using holistic time management to find solutions that work for your mind, your body, and your soul.

Uriah
That's wonderful. I would have guess that you get into quite a bit of emotions in psychology when you go digging into the calendar, so to speak, and how do you spend your time?

Becca
Yes.

Uriah
That must be actually quite rich and interesting.

Becca
It's so fun. I absolutely adore the work that I do and the clients that when in session. When we got on this call, I was like, I just got down the session and I'm like, Hi. I love life. I'm just so grateful to be having that experience. Every single call, basically, that I get off of is like that. And what a life.

Uriah
So would you say you help people get their life back?

Becca
Yeah, but that's unspecific.

Uriah
Yeah. Maybe that's not a good headline. We'll workshop that. Yeah. Actually, you have a very good copy on your website, by the way. The way you unpack and explain what you do and the concepts, really, really well done. I have to say.

Becca
Thanks. I appreciate that.

Uriah
Yeah, it's good. Good stuff. So for the therapist listening to this, some folks are solo practice owners, so it's just them. But they're probably very busy, most likely, as you know, as you probably know, the mental health needs of the world and of the United States People in the US have only expanded in the last couple of years. So we're all as therapists, trying to work hard to meet the need, meet the demands. Some folks are group practice owners, so they've got multiple clinicians working in their practice. Those folks, probably even busier with all kinds of administrative and marketing and business growth and management tasks. A lot to do. So what are the potential benefits, I guess, for those folks of maybe applying some of the principles that you share and teach? What's the good outcome that they could hope for?

Becca
Yeah, I see it as this massive snowball effect, this ripple effect. And so at its core, you get to show up better for yourself. You are much more in tune with how you feel, what you need. And that's as therapists, what you're probably helping all of your clients do. And so when we're busy, we forget that we have needs and we forget to just be. And so that is like the pebble dropping in the water. And then from that place, we get to make more aligned decisions. We get to show up better for clients and our loved ones and experience less anxiety and stress and overwhelm. And from that place, we get to work less and we get to make more money and we get more things done by just being in tune with ourselves because we're not, you know, distracting or procrastinating or doing all these things to avoid the work or ourselves or the present moment. And from that place, it's a cultural effect. It goes bigger than us, right? Because your clients and your team members or your loved ones, the people in your life notice the difference in you and they notice that you're not rushing and that you're not complaining that it's already May fourth and you can't believe it's already 2020. And all of those cultural societal things about time that we say to each other, I'm so busy. So yeah, it's like that snowball effect that is intergenerational healing. And it just goes bigger than all of us. Wow. Nice. You just brought it in all of us.

Uriah
That's fantastic. It's interesting to me that other cultures, we were talking about traveling, have very different relationships with time and pace and work. And I think.

Becca
That's one of my books.

Uriah
There you go, right? Yeah. We've got a lot to learn here about that. I've got friends that are just getting back from trips to Spain and Italy and some other countries and definitely places where they have some different values around getting stuff done. I think what you're trying to say is that, and there's the word holistic, right? It's better for you as a person. You're going to be better off. The people you love are going to be better off because you're doing well. Your clients are going to do better because you're doing well. And then maybe the whole world changes.

Becca
And then the whole world changes. Yeah. What a dream. And that is this vision that I have, right, is with this work, I want everyone that I touch with this work to have time for everything that's important to them as a human. And I want people to have that space and have fun and enjoy their days instead of trying to get through them and muscle through and to feel enough, to feel at peace, to feel safe and content to have your needs met.

Uriah
That's so good. There's a lot of things that ambitious type A folks like you and I are inclined to, I don't know, aspire to. And I'm not saying this about you for sure, but I want my business to cross the million dollar mark, seven figures, or I want whatever it is that is the desire or the goal. And some people still obviously brag about how much they work. Like, how are you doing busy? That's not an emotion nor is it a... It's nothing, right? And it shouldn't be a medal of honor by any means. And I had this thought recently just this week, I was like, What if I start started bragging about how little I work. Maybe that would make me sound like an idiot, too. But I like the idea of being so smart and savvy that I set up my business in such a way that it serves my life and I don't have to work 40 hours a week.

Becca
Why not? Yeah. So I have a group program called 30 hours or Less, and it's for self employed people. And when I was preparing that program and things, there's two statistics that always call out to me. And on average, the average business owner spends about 51 ish hours a week working. And yes, the average business owner also say that they spend about 20 plus hours doing things that they consider wasteful.

Uriah
Oh, my goodness.

Becca
And so it's like, all you have to do, I'm simplifying it, it's not this simple or easy, is to get rid of those 22 hours, reclaim those 22 hours.

Uriah
Right. Wow. That's cool. I would love to take a look at those figures and use them to talk to people about that's so interesting. Yeah, there's a lot of things that we do that are not necessary. And I believe I learned this from Michael Hyatt, who's somebody that I've been listening to for years and talks about a lot of this stuff. The three keys to productivity, I've talked about it for years. I didn't make it up, but I borrowed it. And the first one is elimination. So it's like take away all the things off your task list and off your calendar that really don't matter and really not the most important things to do. And you'd be surprised how much that is. Maybe it's 50 %, 20 %, Yeah. Like 40 %?

Becca
20 hours. Yeah. I always say pruning because I'm a.

Uriah
Holistic time. Pruning. There you go. It's all about the garden. So I have to ask you this question. I know we could talk for hours on all these things, and maybe we'll do a round two, but I have to ask you about your thoughts on time audits, task audits, energy audits, any of those things where you're taking a closer look at how you spend your time and the value of that, or how you advise people to do that?

Becca
Yeah, for sure. I love this question because most time management coaches, that's the first thing that they'll do. And when I became a time management consultant, that's the first thing that they're like, get your person to do a time audit. And after working with people for three years around this, two things come up. The first thing is their to do list is already long.

Uriah
And you.

Becca
Just added to it. And I just added to it. I just told them, you need to do more. And most people are like, I take a very lax approach to homework. I'm not a coach that's like, do this and do this. I literally have one exercise that I basically require clients to do, which is like the whole self exercise of looking at all these different parts of yourself as a whole human being. I have tons of other exercises and resources, but I don't require any of them. And so that's one of the things. The second thing is that time audits or energy audits, whatever, are shadow work. It's hard to be honest with how long things take. It takes a lot of courage, bravery, honesty, and compassion and curiosity. Those are two words that come up a lot. And it's scary and hard to do that by yourself.

Uriah
Yeah, that makes sense.

Becca
Those are the two things that my clients really come up hard against when I am like, Maybe we should look at how you spend your time. And so I talk about it in a more spiritual, ethereal way of like, let's call it time awareness. How can we increase your awareness about how your time is spent? And it doesn't have to look like an app or a spreadsheet. I had one client recently say, Do you use an app for time tracking or whatever? I'm like, God, no. I don't like that. I'm not that person. And she was like, Oh, thank God. She didn't even... Later on in another call, she was like, I'm laughing my butt off when you're like, You don't use any apps or anything. The time awareness skill comes in many different forms of how to increase that awareness. Lots of different exercises that I offer my clients, but really the picture is like, can you slow down just a little bit to just even look at how you're spending your time? From that place, what clarity comes forward, what solutions come forward, what answers or action steps that we need to do to continue to increase the spaciousness and the awareness and understanding.

Uriah
That makes a lot of sense. I agree with you on the challenge of doing those things. And maybe it's not always as effective as we would like it to be. And also, I think most people have a sense of what they need and what they need to do. So bringing some consciousness and some awareness to it might be enough. I will say personally, I have done several proper time audits, like meticulous, and they have been helpful. I did a task audit where instead of tracking the time necessarily, I just wrote down everything that I want, all the tasks that I would do. And those were both really helpful, and they helped me in making decisions, but certainly not how I want to operate on a day to day basis. I did learn one recently, and you probably heard of this for a long time ago, but I had never heard of energy audit. I've heard of the concept of time management is not the thing to focus on. What you need to focus on is your energy because it doesn't matter how much time you have if you have no energy. Yeah, I get it. But this one Yeah. And what would you add to that?

Becca
I think time and energy are the same thing.

Uriah
Okay.

Becca
Yeah. I think when you think... Okay, so I'm an engineer. I read a great book about thermometer dynamics because I love thermo and whatever. And the two fundamental equations in the universe are time and... I don't know now. My brain is farting, but it wasn't... Maybe it was time and heat, which I guess is energy. Essentially what I took away from that was it's life force. It is just they're so connected that you can't really separate them.

Uriah
That is a really good point. Yeah. We like to make distinctions as human beings of things that are not necessarily distinct. But this idea of this energy audit, or at least the way it was presented, I really liked. And I'm going to try it myself. I did try it myself. And basically, it's going and looking at the last week of your calendar, for example, for any period of time. And then just looking at every single calendar entry, every single thing you did or was on your schedule, and then just rating it as either energy improving or additional... I'm not finding the right words either now. Thanks. Yeah. Energy positive or energy negative. And then from that, you can pretty quickly see like, okay, certain kinds of clients give me energy, or certain kinds of meetings or appointments or calls, and then certain other activities are always a drain. Honestly, for me, it's like if I have too many meetings in a day or too many meetings back to back, as an introvert, I just want to go in hibernation mode. But I like that idea because a lot of times we operate on obligation and the things we should do and the thing we always feel like we should say yes to so many different things. But when we go and look at it and go, Oh, yeah, what do I want? What feels good? What brings me joy? All that. It might be a different story.

Becca
Yeah, for sure. And I think when it comes down to it, it's your life force, right? Your human energy, time, space, frequency, emotions, whatever the thing you want to resonate the most of it. I've had a client do... She was into the vibration frequencies. Have you seen that chart, the triangle with all of the different... It's like an emotion emits a frequency. And so it's like this pyramid of contracting and expanding frequencies, and they're connected to feelings. So the top, as you can imagine, is like, enlightenment joy, peace, love, all of that stuff. And then moving downward in frequency. And so it was essentially the same, looking at her week and figuring out how her frequency was based on what she was doing at that time. And that was an interesting exercise.

Uriah
My clients.

Becca
Are brilliant. I'm sure some.

Uriah
People would want the spreadsheet and the time tracking app, and then some people would want the Vibrational Chart, the frequency chart, right? Yeah. It just depends on what people respond to. But I think maybe I would propose that the end result is somewhat the same ot similar, right? Is being more aware of how you use your time and how you focus on the things that are important. Yeah, I like it. So as we wrap up, would you say that there's anything, and maybe this is not the right question, but is there any shift or change that you've seen people make that might be the most impactful? The smallest change that brings the biggest result is what I'm thinking. And if there isn't something, that's fine. But I'm just curious if you noticed anything.

Becca
Yeah. Personally, what changed for me when I was doing this work, I think probably about five years ago now, I started writing out essentially that task audit, but it was more of in that spiritual, ethereal, how can I acknowledge myself for what I had done? And it wasn't just to do less tasks. It was like, get out of bed and take a shower and make breakfast. It was essentially like, what had I done today because of that inner critic and that narrative of I didn't do anything today? That was what I was healing at the time. And so for two years, basically, I every single day, or I wouldn't say every single day, but like, majority of days imperfectly perfect, I wrote out all the things that I had done, humaning, involved, and that shifted so much for me. That time awareness, I was a lot more realistic of what I could put on my plate. I realized three tasks on my to do list at any time, max three done, baby tasks, not big projects that are actually 10 baby tasks under that. And it helped me acknowledge myself. It helped me rest. It helped me shut the computer. It helped me sleep better. It was one of those ripple effects. And it's one of the things that when my clients are really struggling with acknowledging and celebrating themselves or being realistic, it's a time awareness activity or exercise that I offer up and it really does impact quite a bit.

Uriah
I like it. Thanks for sharing that.

Becca
Yeah.

Uriah
It's so interesting. I love that you bring in the engineering and then the spiritual aspect. That's such a cool way to think about these things from different angles.

Becca
Yeah, I love it. Yeah. It's so beautiful. We're humans on this spectrum of rigidity and task master type A all the way to the opposite of... And it's not linear or anything, but to the opposite of like, There is no time and time isn't real. And like, spiritual and loosey goosey and I don't know how to get anything done. And how do you find that sweet spot for yourself that makes you feel safe? Most time management stuff is really just a trauma response to feel safe. And how can you feel safe and you're okay, taken care of, and you can be and rest and be alive and enjoy your life and take care of yourself?

Uriah
I love that. And also reaching your goals, but without burning out and without sacrificing mental health or physical health. I think all of those things are good. I like to, in my book, The Productive Practice, I write that therapists and everybody really deserve to be our business owners. You deserve to have a business that supports your life. You deserve to change the world and also love your life. It doesn't have to be one or the other. And of course, you matter. And your own wellbeing is like... And you agree with this, too, is the foundation.

Becca
It's the only thing that matters.

Uriah
Yeah, it's what you got. You can't really help somebody else if you're in bad shape. I mean.

Becca
Whatever the situation is. You can. And I feel like it's not as rich, or meaningful, or ripe, or transcendent, or transformational, or whatever. It's like, Have you seen Shrinking on Apple TV?

Uriah
Love that show so much. I can't wait for it to come back. I'm so obsessed.

Becca
That's what I think of. He was helping these people in some way, shape, or form, sometimes.

Uriah
Yes, that is a good reference. So yeah, you're correct. You can help people, but to the degree that your own physical and mental health is declining, your actual help is less effective, I would say.

Becca
It's a little bit longer and more nuanced.

Uriah
It's such a good show, though. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. If you are listening to this and you have not watched Shrinking on Apple TV Plus, please pause this episode and go watch it.

Becca
Well, you're done this episode anyway. Just go.

Uriah
Watch it now. Right. There you go. That's your assignment, but it's optional. So good, Becca. Thank you for everything that you shared. And so if people want to find out more about your services and just learn about the cool stuff that you do, where should they go?

Becca
Yeah, the holistic time coach.com or on Instagram, The Holistic Time Coach.

Uriah
Awesome. Thanks so much.

Becca
Yeah, thank you.